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- Experimento de Lección por Hablantes Nativos de Español
Hola todos! Me llamo Daniel. Soy un estudiante de doctorado en neurolingüística en una universidad en Japón.
Estoy conducido un experimento de lección por los hablantes nativos de Español y estoy buscando por participantes. El experimento es muy, muy fácil y tarda a unos 15 minutos. Para el intercambio de su participación, quiero ofrecerle 30 minutos de práctica de conversación de ingles via Skype cuando sea conveniente para usted.
No puedo decir el objetivo (por qué es posible que los participantes cambia sus comportamientos). Pero le presentará oraciones en frases, y tiene que pulsar la barra espaciadora para avanzar al siguiente frase. Por ejemplo:
[Tú] / [pusiste] / [el libro] / [en el estante equivocado].
(/ == pulse el barro espaciadora)
Y después del oración, hay una pregunta de comprensión muy fácil. Por ejemplo:
¿Qué pusiste en el estante equivocado?
1. El libro. (pulse 1 por esta respuesta)
2. La revista. (pulse 2 por esta respuesta)
En total, hay 80 oraciones, pero porque es muy fácil, no tarda mucho tiempo. Me sorprendería si tomara más de 20 minutos.
<style type="text/css"> p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica} p.p2 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica; min-height: 14.0px} </style>
Si quiere participar, por favor escribe un comento aquí o envíame un mensaje privado, y le enviaré el enlace por el experimento! ¡Gracias por su ayuda y espero que hablar con usted muy pronto!
<style type="text/css"> p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica} p.p2 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica; min-height: 14.0px} </style><style type="text/css"> p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica} </style><style type="text/css"> p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica} </style>March 27, 201910 - 日本語で "The place where [something happened]." って何て言うの? I'm having trouble figuring out how to say "the place where something happened," particularly with the use of で. For example: "Tomorrow, I am going to the place where the oldest human remains were found." My attempt: 「明日、一番古い人間の遺体を見つけられた場所に行きます。」でも、もし二つの文書を書いたら、「明日、Krugensdorpに行きます。この場所で一番古い人間の遺体を見つけられた。」って言うでしょう?だから、「で」を使わなくてはいけないと思っていますが、分かりません。助けてください! ところで、この場合には「遺体」と「遺骨」と「遺構」と「亡骸」どち使ったほうがいいですか?November 6, 201580
- 留守電 / Have me confused 確認するため、「留守電をかけてくださったようで、ありがとう。」英語では "I got your voicemail. Thanks." みたいですか? In response to this, I'd like to say "I never left you a voicemail, so I think you have me confused with someone else." I know the person who sent this email to me, just in case that affects the nuance of what I should say. Any good ways to translate that sentence? Thanks!!July 14, 201530
Part 2:
Essentially, we need modifiers. We can't just say 'fluent' and 'not fluent'. Personally, I opt for "I'm conversationally fluent, but I lack the vocabulary for native-like fluency." (I would put 'conversational' somewhere between quick and native according to your scale)
But you're right, everyone can define fluency differently, and most people (read: language learners) do. I have often wondered what the standardized vocabulary could be. I've wonder this both for the sake of resumes, as well as because I'm a terribly logical person who hates so much ambiguity. So, I think it might be beneficial somewhere down the line for someone wiser than I to come up with a standardized nomenclature for the various fluencies (one that is distinctly different from test scores, mind you).
I do really like the CEFR for talking about how much knowledge someone has in a given language. And beyond that, it does provide good organization for learning a new language in a reasonable progression (and I've always said that organization is one of the hardest parts of learning a foreign langauge). But you're right in your comments when you said it doesn't describe fluency. And again, that is where your article fills in the gap.
Most of all, I like that you relate these descriptors to providing better clarity for one's goals. I don't think I've tried describing my goals in that way, and I think it could be beneficial as the name of the goal, so to speak. Of course, more details on how to achieve it would be necessary, but I think it could provide a more SMART goal (search that acronym if you're unfamiliar with it).
Well, I've just about written an article of my own here... So, with all that being said, thanks for the good read! :D
0 votedJuly 9, 20150Part 1:
(Yes, it's that long...)
While I think Peter is a jerk-wad, I think he makes a valid point in his first comment. Personally, when I consider the meaning of anything in depth ('life' included), I think starting with the dictionary definition is a great springboard for further contemplation. My agreement with Peter ends there, as I think your article was well-written and provided great insight beyond the definition.
In my experience, having lived in Japan for a couple years, just about everyone has asked me "Are you fluent?" Though it might be a slight oversimplification, let's assume I had roughly the same Japanese level as I went through the following stages of responses to that question:
1) Not even close dude, I sound nothing like a native
2) Well answering the question you actually asked, yes, I can speak smoothly without holding up most daily conversations, though it depends on the topic. Answering what you think you asked, no I haven't mastered Japanese, I can't read every kanji, I have an accent when I speak, I don't know all of the vocabulary a native knows (including slang), and sometimes I need the other person to repeat themselves.
3) Yes.Eventually I figured what the hell, they don't understand what their asking, why bother trying to make them understand the answer. But the third answer I arrived at really goes back to that dictionary definition: spoken or written with ease (smooth, graceful, etc.). I think that answer is fundamentally true. But, as you assert, it is incomplete.
So basically, all of these responses are insufficient, because, in my opinion, it is an insufficient question, backed by a fundamentally flawed understanding of how foreign language learning works. Nonetheless, it is the question we've been given, and that is where I think your article fits in quite nicely.
0 votedJuly 9, 20150
